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Dirk-Jan posted:

Hi fellow dutchies,

Today after visiting the RDW and such i got the final decission about the road use of the c5:

* When you wanna ride it without implementing a pedelec mode you gotta insure it as an "invalide voertuig". This will cost you €35 a year at Erna Verzekeringen.

* When you implement a pedelec mode (about €200/300 once) you dont have to have insurance on it, when you get pulled over by the cops just tell them its an supporting e-bike.

No insurance and no pedelec mode = ILLEGAL in the netherlands. This will cost you €550 when caught.


Hallo medenederlanders,

Vandaag na een bezoek aan het RDW Keurstation, heb ik uitsluitsel gekregen over hoe een sinclair c5 in het verkeer te gebruiken. Dit zijn de opties:

* Wanneer je je sinclair standaard wil houden kan je bij Erna Verzekeringen hem verzekeren als invalide voertuig (Alleen WA). Hierna krijg je een bromplaatje en kost het 35 euro per jaar.

* Wanneer je een trapondersteuningssensor inbouwt dan hoef je hem niet te verzekeren. Enige nadeel is dat dit 2 a 300 euro kost. Bij aanhouding kan je melden dat dit een normale ondersteunende electrishe fiets is en dus gelijk je weg vervolgen.

Geen verzekering of trapondersteuningssensor en wel aangehouden dan kunnen ze een boete uitdelen van 550 euro.
posted on: 18/09/2014 07:23:52

Dan posted:

Thanks for posting your findings. I'm sure they will be useful to others
posted on: 18/09/2014 19:36:44

TyHawk posted:

Hallo Dirk-Jan,
I am a Englishman, residing in Noord Holland, and an owner of a much 'updated' SINCLAIR C5.

This information is indeed good news to me, and I am sure to many others in 'The Netherlands'. The last I had heard was that the RDW needed to see the vehicle for an inspection, costing 195,00 Euro. With the inspections to be done in Groningen!

I have even designed and partially built a 'PEDELEC' control system, but it is 'still in development'. Having spent most of this summer adding a 3 speed hub with a newly designed chain tension-er, disc brakes for both front and rear (from Chas,) and a 100Amp PWM electronic 'twist grip' throttle control, with 'cut-outs' for the (2)brakes and the motor 'over temperature'. A 92mm fan has been installed and the motor has been modified for 'through-flow' which is cooled with its own dedicated temperature controller.

At only 35,00Euro/year for en 'blau plaatje' to be legal and keep the Politie happy, I am considering postponing, or even abandoning the idea of 'PEDELEC' control.

Dank U wel,

met vriendelijk groet,

Ty Hawkins.

posted on: 20/09/2014 08:02:35

Dirk-Jan posted:

Hi TyHawk,

Im living in groningen and skipped all the national telephone bullshit and got directly to the inspectionstation to talk to a "RDW Keurmeester". An throttle controll is more then welcome on the sinclair else its fullspeed or no speed at all. An hivis set is also more then welcome.

So please keep on improving your sinclair and for the time you arent ready just buy the blue license tag.
posted on: 20/09/2014 11:58:03

andries.moss posted:

Hallo and thanks for the info.
So basically just insure it as a mobility scooter. And no pedelec or politie problems?
As I am a bit lazy and don't wan't to have to pedal 16km to work and back. So I am against the pedelec option. And don't get caught doing 45kph lol
MVG Andy
posted on: 21/09/2014 09:52:11

Dirk-Jan posted:

if you follow the rules letter by letter its allowed to do 45 (+10% extra) without problems. If 50 is smart in a sinclair? I doubt it. Also your allowed at 80km roads, again you should ask yourself is it smart?
Get a blue scootmobiel tag and ride away without any problems.

Last side note:
Some insurances need you to be disabled (bad knees or something), so if they ask you this tell them. There is no real way to check for them if its true.
posted on: 21/09/2014 10:15:49

andries.moss posted:

Hoi Dirk
All good then really. I wouldn't to take it on an 80kph road. I think 45 cars are a dangerous nightmare. (I can't believe people put their children in one.) Although 45 in a C5 is fast enough. The brakes do not work at that speed. And touching the back one will send you off to the right and probably into a canal lol.
I have a disc brake fitted to the front. So that does the job rather well.
Thanks again
posted on: 21/09/2014 14:27:25

TyHawk posted:

Well Guys,

I have followed-up these two leads, by applying on-line for insurance.

ERNA followed-up by phoning me and asked for proof of my immobility.

The ANVB said that they did not insure the C5, as it was not on their list!

Any other ideas 'sympathetic to the cause' are welcome.

Ty Hawkins.
posted on: 27/09/2014 07:15:19

Dirk-Jan posted:

Enra didnt ask proof from me. Maybe you can call the ANWB and give them PPS013 as numberplate to proof its to be insured this way.

You als can try and go to your doctor and ask for a note saying your knee's are bad.
posted on: 27/09/2014 07:23:58

Karl posted:


we have the same problem with the legality here in Germany. If a C5 is used in it's original state, the following could happen.

Being charged with using an unregistered vehicle.
Charged with having no vehicle insurance.
Charged for not wearing a helmet.

Plus with 90% probability the C5 will be impounded and not returned, and here the fines are incredibly stiff, a fine of €550 would be a gift.

Pedelec seems to be the only solution, or go for a 6 kmh version (see under 'RESOURCES', 'Newspaper and Magazine Articles'. It is possible to register a C5 as an invalid carriage, but a valid Invalid ID must be carried at all times. Here the doctors very cautious, as Urkundenfälschung (falsifying an official document) is a criminal offense. I forgot to add, all new invalid registrations are limited to 18 kmh to comply with the new EU regs. I'm surprised when you mentioned 45 kmh.

With the spate of Chinese illegal e-bikes and scooters, and tuned scooters, being use by mainly young kids, the Bulls (cops) have been ordered to crack down on offenders.

I live in the suburbs of Munich, and the central police station for the surrounding area is located about 1 kick from me. So there is a very good change that I'd be controlled.

My brother lives in the south of Holland, next to the German boarder, and he informs me that the laws in Holland are far more lenient as here.

Anyway, all the best of luck with your ideas.


Edit underlined.
posted on: 10/11/2014 22:31:32

Dirk-Jan posted:

over here we dont have an official thingy for being disabled, thats why they give them out so easy.

If its <120cm wide you can ensure it this way, so a Arola 20 is fine to. (while that one is petrol based)
posted on: 11/11/2014 07:33:07